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Post by sfgreg on Aug 28, 2018 20:30:09 GMT -5
I have made major headway with cleaning up the Printed Circuit Board that lies behind the also newly replaced rocker panel switches (yes, I have one of the OLD ones, not the membrane), and feeds (or is fed by) the now also newly replaced circuit breakers. I'm pretty proud of myself - I have NO idea what I'm doing, but i cleaned everything by disconnecting one wire at a time, spraying the connection and the board with contact cleaner and using a toothbrush to get rid of corrosion, and then spraying the connection with dielectric grease, and replacing it. All of the switches, including the horn button and the 12v lighter style plug now work (even my phone charger works), whereas only one of them did before - YAY!!!!!!!
the labels and panel are, as of now, Horn (push button), switches NAV/ANC, Bilge auto (off and on), baitwell, Deck Lights, accessory 1 (no idea what it is) and accessory 2 (stereo system), 12 volt DC outlet for phone chargers etc.
However, here's what's still happening/not working - and I'm hoping someone here knows what can be done.
1) the NAV/ANC switch (4 pole switch on/off/on) - the NAV position powers the front light that's flush with the bow (green and red I think it was), and the ANC powers a white light on a pole inserted at the back - however they never all come on together. Is that the desired behavior?
2) The baitwell button does nothing. I have a "tsunami" brand pump for something in the back next to the bilge that I thought was for the washdown, but I've just read they're sometimes for both washdown and baitwell? Is that true on this case? perhaps the fuse is simply blown in the pump motor? ideas?
3) one of the connections on the PCB (printed circuit board) almost pulled free of the board today, and is now dangling precariously although is still connected. I swore at myself for that one - and left that connection alone. The corrosion has kinda fused the female wired termination to the male circuit board mounted prong. Does anyone know if there's a junker boat somewhere with one of these boards on it, or some type of replacement available anywhere? I've searched online - nothing. The thought of having to oneday have everything bypass that PCB and rewiring the whole boat (my first boat which I've owned a week), sounds incredibly daunting. I also suppose I could remove the entire board (if there was some insane way to remember how to plug it all back in again) and re-do the solder at that point on the PCB.
4) this time when I repaint and remount the switch plate, I want to use some caulk or whatever is recommended here to keep water out of the switch area (which I know is impossible entirely). Suggestions?
5) the horn "works" but is feeble and barely audible - kinda funny - are there after-marker horns that could go in the same side mounted horn slot?
I guess that's it - unless i think of something - i was kinda overwhelmed and shocked when it all worked again. And now I wonder when it won't again
Thanks all.
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Post by Team Ruby on Aug 28, 2018 22:35:47 GMT -5
Very satisfying to restore things back to working order isn't it! 1) With regards to the operation of your NAV/ANC lights the following is how they are supposed to work. In the NAV position both the bi-color nav bow lights and the 360° all-round anchor light should be lit. When the switch is moved to the ANC position then only the 360° all-round white lit will be lit. I noticed in your first post the pictures of your switches that your NAV/ANC switch is a SPDT type switch. The very top terminal on the switch is a source for ground and its only purpose is to supply a ground for the switch indicator light inside the switch. The internal light gets voltage whenever the switch is turned on to either position. Of the other three tabs in the vertical configuration the center tab is the positive 12 volt supply lead for the switch. The bottom tab goes to the ANC lights and the top tab goes to the 360° white light. What I didn't see in your photos was a diode, which I would expect to see in an SPDT configuration. My thought was that perhaps the diode was part of the circuit board, but that does not now appear to be the case. If it is built into the circuit board there is something wrong with it, but the fix is simple. All you need is to buy a small diode like this: www.amazon.com/AKOAK-Schottky-Blocking-Diodes-15SQ045/dp/B01CXOQMJ8/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1535512173&sr=8-3&keywords=diode+12vThe diode will be installed as a jumper between the NAV and ANC tabs on the switch. In your case this can be done on the backside of the pcb. You'll notice that the diode has a gold band on one end. That side of the diode will be connected/bridged to the ANC light tab on the pcb, which will be the upper tab. The other end of the diode will be connected to the NAV light tab. What happens is when the NAV side of the switch is turned on voltage is applied to the nav lights and the diode will also carry voltage up to the anchor tab and both nav and anchor lights will illuminate. When the ANC light is turned on voltage is applied to the anchor light tab and the diode blocks voltage from reaching the nav lights that are bridged into the circuit. Below is a link to a schematic for your lights; see the second post down. sailfishownersforum.proboards.com/thread/3/wiring-diagrams2) Can you post a picture of the pump or provide a model number. To my knowledge no one makes a combined bait well and washdown pump. Sailfish in later models does use a bait well pump that has a pass through for the washdown pump, which is a separate pump, see link below. I also noticed that Tsunami makes a lot of aerator pumps, which yours might be. sailfishownersforum.proboards.com/thread/114/shurflo-bait-sentry-11003) You may not have to make a complete new wire loom, you might find that you only need to modify the pcb board for some of the failing circuits. From what I've read so far this would be well within your skillset. 4) I would suggest a caulk of some type as opposed to an adhesive sealant. If you need to take it apart in the future you want it to be an easy task. Some of the guys here can recommend something that would work well. 5) I don't know if a direct replacement is available, but a replacement will be similar in size and shouldn't present much of a problem to repair. It looks like this one right? www.amazon.com/MPC-1606-Electric-Stainless-Resistant/dp/B00KRO1OSQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1535513638&sr=1-1&keywords=boat+hornNo? Not even close? Fin, help me out here!
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Post by sharkbait on Aug 29, 2018 4:58:32 GMT -5
for sealing the switch plate, take a look at boatlife’s life seal.
for the livewell pump make sure the valve inside the livewell is open. if it’s closed the pump likely has a pressure switch keeping it off, so you wouldn’t hear it kick on.
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Post by sharkbait on Aug 29, 2018 5:02:29 GMT -5
and my livewell and raw water washdown are serviced by the same pump, but it’s not a tsunami.
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Post by outtadblue on Aug 29, 2018 6:02:09 GMT -5
Teamruby pretty much has the electrical part covered. As for the horn, most small boat horns are pretty weak sounding. If yours makes a load noise, it's probably ok. If not, they are easy to change. West marine has a couple to choose from. For sealant, I would recommend a non adhesive marine silicon. Good luck with your project. It sounds like your doing good so far.
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Post by Team Ruby on Aug 29, 2018 8:14:28 GMT -5
and my livewell and raw water washdown are serviced by the same pump, but it’s not a tsunami. How is that accomplished on your boat, does the pump connect to either a Y fitting or a Y-valve?
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Post by sharkbait on Aug 29, 2018 9:02:31 GMT -5
It’s been a while but I believe its just a barbed Y fitting splitting the hosing.
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Post by Team Ruby on Aug 29, 2018 9:07:25 GMT -5
Hmm, do you have separate switches for live well and washdown? So I would assume that when you turn the hose on to rinse the deck the pressure is weak in both the live well and the washdown.
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Post by sharkbait on Aug 29, 2018 9:18:21 GMT -5
yes i have separate switches but i’ve never tried running the raw washdown with the livewell valve open. i removed my freshwater pump this spring and recall noting how the raw water pump was plumbed, but i should take another look before i give bad information.
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Post by Team Ruby on Aug 29, 2018 10:48:50 GMT -5
As long as it works for you is all that really matters. If you want to ever change it it's not too difficult in theory to change it. The biggest challenge on our boats is having enough room to work in.
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Post by sfgreg on Aug 30, 2018 8:30:47 GMT -5
It turns out I was able to salvage the livewell pump, which has a 'y' connector installed that also serves the washdown. It is a Tsunami. The wiring had been disconnected. I won't know if all works as it should until I take it on the water, but the motor buzzing. I assume closing the livewell valve would bring water to the washdown and vice versa.
It seems that this is a common motor sharing concept - and Tsunami makes one with a y connector on the unit (mine does now, but has a hose configuration that amounts to the same thing).
I'll post about the NAV/ANC situation in a minute - with pics. Thanks.
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Post by sfgreg on Aug 30, 2018 8:46:14 GMT -5
Very satisfying to restore things back to working order isn't it! 1) With regards to the operation of your NAV/ANC lights the following is how they are supposed to work. In the NAV position both the bi-color nav bow lights and the 360° all-round anchor light should be lit. When the switch is moved to the ANC position then only the 360° all-round white lit will be lit. I noticed in your first post the pictures of your switches that your NAV/ANC switch is a SPDT type switch. The very top terminal on the switch is a source for ground and its only purpose is to supply a ground for the switch indicator light inside the switch. The internal light gets voltage whenever the switch is turned on to either position. Of the other three tabs in the vertical configuration the center tab is the positive 12 volt supply lead for the switch. The bottom tab goes to the ANC lights and the top tab goes to the 360° white light. What I didn't see in your photos was a diode, which I would expect to see in an SPDT configuration. My thought was that perhaps the diode was part of the circuit board, but that does not now appear to be the case. If it is built into the circuit board there is something wrong with it, but the fix is simple. All you need is to buy a small diode like this: www.amazon.com/AKOAK-Schottky-Blocking-Diodes-15SQ045/dp/B01CXOQMJ8/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1535512173&sr=8-3&keywords=diode+12vThe diode will be installed as a jumper between the NAV and ANC tabs on the switch. In your case this can be done on the backside of the pcb. You'll notice that the diode has a gold band on one end. That side of the diode will be connected/bridged to the ANC light tab on the pcb, which will be the upper tab. The other end of the diode will be connected to the NAV light tab. What happens is when the NAV side of the switch is turned on voltage is applied to the nav lights and the diode will also carry voltage up to the anchor tab and both nav and anchor lights will illuminate. When the ANC light is turned on voltage is applied to the anchor light tab and the diode blocks voltage from reaching the nav lights that are bridged into the circuit. Below is a link to a schematic for your lights; see the second post down. sailfishownersforum.proboards.com/thread/3/wiring-diagrams2) Can you post a picture of the pump or provide a model number. To my knowledge no one makes a combined bait well and washdown pump. Sailfish in later models does use a bait well pump that has a pass through for the washdown pump, which is a separate pump, see link below. I also noticed that Tsunami makes a lot of aerator pumps, which yours might be. sailfishownersforum.proboards.com/thread/114/shurflo-bait-sentry-1100HI Teamruby - I was at the boat with a mechanic yesterday working on a motor issue (which I'll post about separately) but I got some good pics to zoom in on what's already installed at the NAV/LIGHT switch on the PCB. It seems there already is some type of bridge connection in place, and perhaps it's just hooked up incorrectly. If after seeing the pics you think the diode is the way to go, I'll still try that fix, but hoped a closer look at that exact spot (front and back) might make the solution more apparent. One pic shows the front of the PCB where the 4 pole rocker switch connects. It's this exact switch - www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00P5R1CE6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1The other pic is an angled shot of what's behind that same switch on the PCB (and slightly to the right of it - I assume related directly to that switch and not any of the other 5, but that's just an assumption). There are 4 pins in total coming from the PCB in that location, and here's my description of that pic - the top pin is bridged (or jumped?) to the bottom one, the second one from the top has the orange wire connected, and the third pin down is empty. I did have those connectors off to clean things up, but I'm pretty sure I messed with trying bridging it a few different ways with no success (to get both front and back lights to come on when the switch is set the NAV, and it is now where I'm almost 100% sure it was originally - not that that was correct either. There's no evidence there was even a diode attached to the PCB in that area - no loose solder or lumps etc. You're help is amazing. Thanks - appreciate any further insights. Read more: sailfishownersforum.proboards.com/thread/179/new-2002-198-ongoing-repairs?page=1#ixzz5PfXJYdhj
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Post by Team Ruby on Aug 30, 2018 9:22:14 GMT -5
OK, the pictures were great and I do see what I hope is the only issue with the NAV/ANC lights. The jumper, which does have a diode is installed incorrectly. The connection to the bottom tab is the wrong tab. The bottom tab is for a ground and it's there for a different type of switch, so the bow light is getting ground on both sides of the light. As it sits now the bow lights should not come on at all. Move the bottom connector up to the empty tab, this tab is the one that supplies 12V + to the bow light and the anchor light. If when you move the connector you find that the bow light stays on in either position and the anchor light turns off in the nav position all you need to do is reinstall the jumper wire by reversing the two connectors that the bridge is attached to.
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Post by sfgreg on Aug 30, 2018 9:25:59 GMT -5
As it sits now the bow lights should not come on at all. Probably my biggest concern - as it stands, the bow lights DO come on in NAV position. Rear pole light comes on in ANC. They never both come on. I'll try your fix as you suggest when Im back over there and report back. Fingers crossed Thanks again teamruby.
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Post by Team Ruby on Aug 30, 2018 9:42:06 GMT -5
If the bow light is turning on now the way the switch is wired there is a problem. It kind of tells me that the bow light is getting 12V + all the time and is coming on when ground is applied, totally backwards. Let me think of an easy method to test this.
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